You own property in Vancouver? Not if the Mayor says you don't
When asked by a reporter on another subject close to his heart, Vancouver Mayor Gregor Robertson pointed out that civil disobedience was an option for opponents to oil tankers in Burrard Inlet. Although the statement wasn't particularly mayoral, it barely registered on the Gregor quote-o-meter.
Now in the midst of a particularly difficult land dispute involving Vancouver property owners and the Musqueam First Nations, Gregor Robertson has done something highly inappropriate and in the process complicated the matter even further. He first stated publicly that he is on the side of the Musqueam Band in the matter, and proceded to demonstrate his support by going to drum with protesters. The image of Gregor Robertson drumming his way into controversy, had it garnered any other coverage than the front cover of a community paper and a few blogs, might have cemented Vancouver's image as a town of flakes in the minds of most Canadians.
What most citizens of Vancouver don't realize, however, is the Mayor's actions were irresponsible and borderline ridiculous.
Those of us who are property owners in Vancouver would shudder to think if, one day, our homes were subject to a land dispute. Of course, we'd be forced to seek costly legal help, but surely we could count on public service professionals and members of our local government to be impartial and apply the law fairly in our case. Then picture how would it make you feel if the mayor of your city rolled up to your front gate, banging a drum to say he supports the guys who wants your stuff.
Consider how you'd feel if you or your family has held title for the land for over a half century. And not only that, you've only been recently issued a development permit to build on the land in the past sixth months – subject to a respectful dig in search of remains. Oh, and you've pre-sold 70 units of the building, which you decided to build as affordable housing in part to satisfy the political objectives of the city government.
It's not a dream, dear reader. It's reality here in Vancouver. A family who owns property on a strip of land between Marine Drive and a railway bed for over 50 years, in the shadow of the Arthur Laing Bridge onramp, have recently been told by both City of Vancouver officials and the Province of BC that they were able to develop the property and sold housing units in good faith, have been royally betrayed by the elected leader of the city.
Suzanne Anton with Musqueam elder, 2004
Let me disgress by stating my own position on this matter. I happen to respect the Musqueam's efforts to gain control of the land referred to as the Marpole Midden. It's an ancient burial site for the band's ancestors, and is near the site of not only a former First Nations village, but one of the founding communities of Metro Vancouver known as Eburne. The land has historical significance not only for First Nations, but the foundation of our city. I attended a Musqueam ceremony at the Midden site in April 2004 with then Park Commissioner Suzanne Anton and City Councillor Peter Ladner, and see the property as a cornerstone of revitalization in the Marpole neighbourhood.
Creating an important public space with sacred and historical significance at one of the gateways to the city would be a splendid idea, and a welcome alternative to bridge on-ramps that divide the community. Currently the Musqueam have no such plans for the property, however. Rather, they have expressed the idea of turning the length of the Midden property into a national historical heritage site and possibly adding a museum.
Now, for the political junkie in me there's a delicious irony. The man who has been hired to negotiate with the City on behalf of the property owners is former NPAer Bob Ransford. Ransford was the architect of the 2008 centre-right split that led to the NPA's near complete wipeout. He's sidled up with Mike Magee and the Visionistas since, and despite embracing Vancouver's NDP farm team politically he's in tough with his client since Gregor's drum routine.
So as a citizen of Vancouver I have to ask Gregor Robertson: what the hell were you thinking? Was it nothing more than what one expert on aboriginal land disputes described to me as 'embarrassing grandstanding', or do you think Vancouver's legal department just needs to work harder? Not for a moment do I think Robertson had the consent of his caucus to do this, as supportive as some of them might be for his choice. This was a drum solo act (with Andrea Reimer on tamborine).
Arthur Laing protest (Carmine Marinelli/24 Hours)
Notwithstanding the sensitivity of the land dispute and the resulting protests (likely emboldened by the Mayor's support) which are shutting down major thoroughfares during rush hour, the citizens of Vancouver now must ask who do they turn to when faced with a major property decision in our city. Vancouver City Council is supposed to be a board that governs land decisions, and the Mayor is chair of that board. He has betrayed his ultimate responsibility as a judge in these disputes, created havoc for City staff, and piled on huge legal costs on a Vancouver property owner.
Is it just me or does this episode make Vancouver City Hall look more and more like reality TV?
- post by Mike
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Ransford is reaping what he sowed. As to Moonbeam, the flakiness is true to form.
When I saw the media reports of the mayor coming to the site to support the Musqueam protest, my first thought was “Didn’t the City have to issue a development permit for this site?” I think both the Musqueam and the property owners have been ill-served by the city, that the outcome will be costly and these costs will be borne once again by the taxpayers.
I cannot believe the Mayor stepped into this–there are serious land swap negotiations going on right now as I understand. Hmmm. On second thought…
Ransford was on today, saying that condos had been “pre-sold”. I wonder if that is to pressure the provincial government to make a move, sooner, rather than later. (To my understanding, it involves the natives giving up some other land they have? will be getting? through land claims, and swapping with the current owners of this parcel).
From what I understand, the ‘City’ screwed up on not doing their due diligence when permitting this development and now it is the Province’s responsibility to clean up the mess?
How does that work?
This is privately owned land – not public/Crown land where the need for the Province to step in would be warranted.
Will tax payers be on the hook for a ‘land swap’? Seems we will already dealing with legal fees.
As for Ransford, no sympathy. You lay down with dogs you get up with fleas. He, like so many others are finding out that once Vision doesn’t need you for politcal reasons anymore, you are disposable.
As for Robertson – how about taking care of the things in this City that need to be dealt with instead of playing ill thought out ‘political’ games.
Good on Mayor Robertson! Canada has signed the United Nations Declaration of Indigenous Peoples Rights, which protect and advocate for Indigenous peoples, to include land owners, women, elders, children, farmers, herders, fishing rights, forestry rights, water rights, air rights, mineral rights, medicinal and botanical sacred rights, sacred sites, cemeteries, burial sites, archaeological resources, to name just a few.
I am a tax payer who is proud of our Mayor for standing up for the Rights of the Musqueam Peoples and he is not an embarrassment to our City!
The Musqueam people lived on this land for over 10,000 years and it disgusts me that you are arguing for the Rights of ‘homeowners’ of a mere 50 years or so. This is a peaceful demonstration and it is our rights as Canadian citizens to peacefully demonstrate and Mayor Robertson is a citizen of Canada who is acting well within his rights!
@Penny Irons
I guess Penny, you think everyone who has less than a certain percentage of aboriginal genes in their DNA is a trespasser and should go ‘home’ leaving the ‘pure laine’ aboriginals to return to living in longhouses or dirt dug dwellings, happily weaving cedar bark baskets.
As for me Penny, I dont think continuing with race based analysis has any value or any place in today’s Canada. I identify as a NAN, Non Aboriginal Native, and am equally as indiginous as any group you may choose to fawn over regardless of the length of my ancestors tenure.
For someone who “owns” a house in Vancouver through an intricate American corporation, hand wif being “directors” and declared “renters” not a biggie… I hope someone goes after their Cortes Island ‘holdings” … but that wouldn’t be, who can I put it… kosher!
Another example of someone who should have never be in office. Ayee us poor taxpayers, paying this incompetent close to 1Mill bucks from the public trough. Ayeeee…
OOps… “hand wif being” = “him and his wife being”
@Lee L….I don’t recall saying anything about anyone’s DNA, I stated a FACT and the Inherent Rights of the Musqueam people and I never stated anything about sending anyone home. I think you have a huge problem with ‘our’ rights as Indigenous peoples and that is your ‘stuff’ not mine.
I love all my non Indigenous friends and I don’t believe any of them would build or would want to live on an ancient burial ground! And I certainly don’t want to send any of them back to where they came from and I would never say such a thing, so don’t put words in my mouth!
PS…..I think Gregor Rocks!!! and I think he should stay right where he belongs as Mayor of this Fine City!
The entire world is an “ancient burial ground” so it’s kind of hard to claim no one should live anywhere someone else has died.
Funny how mainstream culture and media had no problem making fun of Asians for fearing ghosts (the UBC hospice) but wouldn’t dare mock the supernatural fears of other cultures.
Doh! That’s why you should consider doing your archeological review BEFORE you start doing construction and selling the now extremely unlikely to happen units.
As for the people that got into the pre-sales that’s the risk you take in a futures contract – if the future doesn’t turn out like you think that “deal” on your as yet unbuilt unit might turn out to be a kick in the pants. Given the number of these people that are all out speculators that doesn’t make me loose sleep at night.
And because the BCTF doesn’t have enough on their own plates to deal with, they have thrown their support behind the Musqueam as well.
These are both nothing but political ploys in the face of the 2012 election.
Perhaps Robertson should stick to DJ’ ing and leave the running of the City to those better qualfied.
(a pig in lipstick comes to mind…..)
BCTF? What a freaking joke and hypocrisy ! THEY are the ones who are failing First Nations children in the schools!!!!!!!
Again, just like Vision – they are using and manipulating an issue for their own personal gains and have no real care about the issues! Makes my blood boil!!!!!!
opps. meant ’2013′ election.
Yikes!
So Penny Irons do I get way more rights than the Filipino family next door who immigrated here last year? After all my family’s been here way longer.
As to the Marpole Midden its basically an ancient garbage dump. If that’s where you decided to bury your ancestors, well…
@Penny Irons, I totally understand and empathize this issue, but I think you have lost sight that your beloved mayor is a man that speaks with forked tongue and Vision are responsible for this mess.
Why was this land noted as a sacred burial ground PRIOR to the sale of the land or permits being issued by City Hall? Before you start blaming the Provincial Government or blaming everyone except for your precious mayor, the Musqueam First Nations should have been looking at what was been going on prior or during the development deal negotiations.
I think you, the land owner and maybe even the developer have been messed around by the incompetency of City Hall and greed. In regards to the developer, they have also invested heavily into the development when you think of paying for permits, architectural design, land preparation etc.
A “simple” land swap sounds like an easy solution but who is going to pay for their investment into this project so far? You are also being used and manipulated by the Mayor for his own political gains – can’t you see that?
At the same time and please excuse me for my ignorance in this particular issue – but why didn’t the Musqueam First Nations bring this issue PRIOR to the deal? Why didn’t you talk to the provincial government to help negotiate this while you were working on the deal with the UBC Golf course?
How many other sacred grounds are there in BC that needs to be identified PRIOR to any land developments?
I am a firm believer that prevention of conflict is the best solution – wouldn’t be better if there was more open dialogue regarding what you feel are your heritage rights in BC?
I have worked in justice issues regarding First Nations and Inuit people and what Canada has done in the past (and now in particular up north) is shocking.
I am very concerned about the youth of the First Nations as they are so neglected in our schools. By grade ten 50% of First Nations children have dropped out of school! So forgive me when I want to puke when I see your Mayor bang a drum when Vision are not addressing some of the serious issues regarding your youth.
I am showing support for you, however, when will this protesting about your sacred rights end?
How long do we the rest of British Columbians have to pay for past mistakes? Hopefully this current issue will be the last.
It seems to me that so much is focused on the past that your future is totally neglected.
And finally, please don’t lose sight Penny, it was your “wonderful” Mayor and Vision Vancouver that caused this mess you are in, not the Provincial Government and certainly not the rest of the people of British Columbia.
You know Mom when you are ignorant about something as you admit, the most sensible policy is to shut up. In any event, how is it the city’s fault when it is the province that has the power to stop it and do a land swap. Clueless Chirpy Cheeks still hasn’t figured that out. But clowns like you will still vote for her next time. You deserve her.
@Waltyss:
As a woman in business and in a sector that is highly male orineted, the insults that you hurl at the current Premier are an insult to all women in business.
So here is my totally female suggestion to you: Put your big boy pants on and gow up. Here is a fact for you… businesses that have women CEO’s show a 30% increase inprofit over their male counterparts.
It is sad that you seem to be so threatened by a female Premier that you have to fall to the lowest denominator in sexualizing and name calling. You my friend are a small, small person.
I am SO sick of the old ‘boys will be boys’ attitude. SICK OF IT. Grow up orstep aside. There are plenty women that are outpacing men…. and your days are numbered my friend,
Mom and teririch: I hate to tell you but there is a giant difference between a woman and an ignorant or stupid woman. Some women are stupid and some women are smart. To insult our pathetic excuse for a premier is not to insult all women; it is just to insult our pathetic excuse for a premier.
So on one side we have intelligent women and on another side we have the premier, Mom and teririch. I guess that is a male chauvinistic left wing commie pinko belief but so be it.
Do I have a solution for the Musqueam issue. A land swap makes the most sense. The province (notwithstanding Chirpy Cheeks ignorance) has the solution to that one probably.
First nations kids drop out rates. Incredibly complicated issue but not one that you seem to bring much to except an ability to hurl cliched insults.
And teririch, in hindsight what the NDP did to the province was not much worse that what the Liberals have done for the past 10 years. So, we need to get rid of this collection of tired nonentities and give the NDP a chance. Chirpy Cheeks in her ignorance is only the latest manifestation of a clueless tired government.
And if Vision or the NDP don’t care about anything, what does that say about the Liberals who have done nothing for families in 10 years. If you think that CC gives a flying kazoo about families, then you are dumber than your posts make you appear.
You claim PLENTY of you remember when the NDP were in power. I think when last l looked that plenty was down to about 22% of the electorate. And close to 50% of the electorate don’t have to remember to know that they want Chirpy Cheeks and her collection of incompetents gone. All we have to think about is Basi and Virk, lies about HST, breaking contracts, the way in which mentally handicapped children have been treated, Campbell’s arrogance and Chirpy Cheeks ignorance. Shall I go on?
@Waltyss
Sorry I’ve not been able to reply to your so carefully crafted reply as I’ve been working. A term I am not sure you are familiar with.
Quick question:
During the economic downturn, which of all the Provinces in Canada faired the best. And why?
Which Province is still out-performing all other Provinces in Canada…and why?
Oh, right, according to the NDP worshipers, it is because the Liberals have totally mismanaged our dollars.
Ha HA – Ransford must be really uncomfortable now that he decided to get into bed with all these NDP nutbars at the city. He truly is reaping what he sowed.
It was Robertson that gave the developer the permit to build the damn thing in the first place. Maybe he should yank the permit now that they found bones? Dont’ count on it. City making too much $
Let’s assume for a moment that the Mayor’s support for the Musqueam on this was inappropriate. I guess it’s fine for Klassen to support them but not the Mayor.
What do you say about your wonderful Premier Chirpy Cheeks who tells us that she cannot meet with the Musqueam because the province has no role in this. Gee, Mike, do you agree with me that May 2013 can’t come soon enough. Just think, Mike, you’ll have all those defeated provincial Liberals able to run for council for the NPA. They won’t win but at least you will have someone with a higher profile than the non-entities that ran last time.
@Waltyss:
‘Her’ name is Premier Clark you muppet. And guess what: this is a private property matter, not provincial regardless of how are the dippers are trying to paint it for their benefit as usual. They don’t give a rats ass about the Musqueam, nor the homeless, nor affordable housing or whatever ’cause of the moment is’ they are nothing more than opportunists – whatever the the sound bite of the moment is accompanied by a cheap photo op.
PLENTY of us remember what the NDP did to this province the last time around and will not go there again. If you want to see the future of the province, you only need to look as far as our good old local ‘City’ hall.
@Waltyss,
You are so quick to throw insults out – but yet I have to seen anything intelligent or tangible in what you are saying.
Do you have a solution to this problem that the Musqueam and developers are facing?
This crappy politicking and exploitation of the issue by the Mayor and BCTF needs to stop and a solution must be resolved. Like I had said earlier – it is better to have prevented this situation from coming up before hand.
How many times to we have to keep facing these same repetitive issues? Lets figure out what lands is considered “sacred” once and for all deal with it and move on.
When it comes to the First Nations we need to help the youth – the future of these bands.
In fact we need to focus on all youth and ensure they have a future with a solid education, jobs and affordable living standards.
But it is sad Waltyss – you don’t see that do you? You just like to throw insults towards women or to people who don’t follow your male chauvinistic left wing commie pinko beliefs! So truly sad!
I agree that throwing around casual slurs about the premier, and the mayor, and the opposition leader, and all of the other people who run for office, makes us look like idiots. However misguided, the vast majority of these people, certaily the premier and the mayor, are acting in what they believe is the general interest.
“At the same time and please excuse me for my ignorance in this particular issue”
You can learn more about the issue from a Musqueam perspective by reading an account of the events leading up to the protest earlier this week.
http://www.musqueam.bc.ca/
(third tab on the right entitled ‘Marpole Village’ in the Kingchauch tongue)
Thanks for the link, Chris. I have to wonder why this negotiation got to the critical stage before things ramped up. The link you posted says the Band has been discussions since March 2012. The Midden issue has been around for a couple generations. How did things break down so much at the City that they would issue the development permit under these circumstances?
For the Mayor to jump into the fray after the administration he leads already issued a development permit suggests he’s disavowing himself of city council’s responsibility in this matter. Very odd if you ask me.
Given that the NDP are now using this issue to jab the Premier, it feels like politics is driving this whole controversy now.
“It seems to me that so much is focused on the past that your future is totally neglected.”
How many hours do you suppose is spent teaching a few hundred years of Western history to children in Canada from Grade One to Twelve? How often do we hear our leaders venerate the elders from that past?
But you would have the people who have lived here for thousands of years sweep that history under a rug and try to move forward without any sense of where they come from? That’s a tall order for a dominant culture, and pretty much impossible for one that has suffered a systemic attempt at eradication. Our cultures are mostly defined by who we have been as a people, where we lived, and how we lived, since we cannot predict with any real sense of certainty where we might be headed. In attempting to preserve this site as a sacred place, it seems to me the Musqueam are fighting hard to give their children a chance to understand their own culture’s long traditions, which is, to me, the first step towards having a desire to represent oneself as another success story to be added to the cultural storehouse.
Chris don’t get me wrong here – I completely understand this situation at hand – I am from a mixed culture including Aboriginal, not from this continent but still understand the importance of our heritage and history. My point is that I see so much focus on the past and feel that the children and youth are being neglected and they feel that their future is grim.
Shouldn’t we be focusing just a little bit more on ensuring the welfare of children, which also mean helping the family as a whole?
Yes I think this situation should be resolved and its heritage be passed on – but what I completely disagree with is politicians and politically motivated groups exploiting the situation. This situation is the flavor of the week for Mayor Robertson – if he was so truly concerned he would have been on top of this situation before hand seeing he has developers as his supporters.
I do admit that I am ignorant to THIS particular situation and thank you for the link so that I can learn more.
But I have also taken the time in the past to learn more about First Nations and Inuit issues BEFORE becoming a Canadian. I know more about the situations regarding first nation’s issues than the regular person off the street because I worked closely with people to who deal with these issues first hand and wanted to make change. I took the time to talk various First Nation’s people across Canada to learn about the history and awful treatment they have received – and it did not matter what political party was in power.
So when I try to voice my understanding of the issue and concern that we are losing focus on more pressing issues regarding the youth at risk – I am insulted because I am female, that I am ignorant and don’t follow some political party.
I really thought that the blog site was to be a forum to exchange ideas and more constructive comments. Sadly I don’t see this. It seems to be a group of people who just want to vent toxic insults at each other and spout their own political ideology.
“Shouldn’t we be focusing just a little bit more on ensuring the welfare of children, which also mean helping the family as a whole?”
Perhaps it’s time to listen rather than proffer unasked-for advice. As a friend said to me (rhetorically)… “What do women want? Why not ask one?”
” You just like to throw insults towards women or to people who don’t follow your male chauvinistic left wing commie pinko beliefs! ”
Oh geez. Pot meet kettle. Please tell me this is one of those instances where I’m just missing the sarcastic tone.
Yes I was being VERY sarcastic. Throwing insults does not help find solutions to problems. I guess some people did not learn this in school or at home?
I wonder if it might not be better to lead by example than descend to the level of the people you’re criticizing?
@Working Mom:
I agree that focus needs to be placed on helping the Aboriginal youth.
Placing plackards on them and marching them in front of cameras for media opps – isn’t that help.
I work in the resource sector and am happy to note that work skill programs have been put into place, both by our local and federal governments in order to train young people and help them into high paying, long term jobs. Skills that will be transferable to other sectors down the road.
More attention needs to be placed on early development and overall education and opportunity.
That is the way out – for all kids.
Robertson should not have gotten involved in this . Period.
It shows how immature he is, how totally unfit to hold office. If he doesn’t understand things like this, what’s there to discuss?
he is a politician in charge of the city, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, …not a freaking mediator!
Mira:
You are entitled to your viewpoint, even if it is simply a matter of venting your spleen.
The good part is, however, that the citizens of Vancouver have spoken and overwhelmingly they chose Mayor Robertson and his Vision team. In fact, you may recall that with Council, Vision won every position they ran for.
You will have another chance in November 2014, if your bile does not consume you first. In the meantime, you are just going to have to accept that the Mayor is indeed in charge of the city. He and his Team will make mistakes; they are not gods. Klassen and his followers will pick them up as well as many that are not mistakes but simply a difference of opinion. That is as it should be; that is democracy and that is politics. Unfortunately, democracy also includes people with your level of hatred and bitterness.
Stephen Forth: I agree with you actually that we should respect all those who run for public office and serve. It is a tough job, not well compensated and they have to suffer hateful and often ignorant attacks. Almost without exception, they serve for the best of motives.
That said, our current premier really tests that notion because while she can do the smile, she demonstrates again and again that she is intellectually unfit for the office. But as I said to Mira, I and a majority of the citizens of this province will have our opportunity to toss her and her followers out next May.
Waltsyss-as much as I hate to interrupt your little mancrush on the mayor,let me remind yoy how civic government works. The mayor oversees a bureaucracy responsible for development permits, including this one. Why didn’t the mayor break out the bongos against the condo sooner? And now you have this midguided belief the Premier should bail Robertson out of his own incompetence? Its his Stanley Cup Riot all over again.
Brilliant not:
If you wanted to have a reasoned debate about this, good. However you appear to be more interested in name calling (sort of typical for this site) and I am not interested.
Based on your use of the term “Premier Chirpy Cheeks” in earlier posts on this article, I must disagree with your claim of personal disinterest in name calling. I’m not judging you for the name calling, I think it’s a pretty funny name, I’m merely pointing out the even more hilarious blatant moral hypocrisy.
Looks more like Brilliant just asked a few uncomfortable questions and you needed an excuse to not answer them, so you chose to attack Brilliant and this website itself.
ps:
I love the way you changed the name from “Brilliant” to “Brilliant not” in your post about how you don’t like name calling. Starting a plea for civility by calling someone an idiot, BRAVO. Having completely subjective ethics must be fun.
I agree with Mike that the implications for private property rights in this case are very serious. Suppose I was to uncover native remains when excavating foundations for building a new house? Would I be subject to this kind of harassment? If I’m not mistaken, doesn’t this happen frequently in Europe and there aren’t the remains detailed and then respectfully removed?
As Brilliant alluded to, why did the City, planning department and Mayor & Council, approve the development permit if it is such a sensitive area? Are they required to approve every permit that comes along? It is not a good place to have approved a condo in the first place. Even before the Arthur Laing bridge this was the industrial side of the tracks, dominated by the Eburne Mill.
I also object to the Musqueam referring to the Metro Theatre as a rundown old building. Is culture only valid when it is theirs?
Finally, they never should have been allowed to blockade the Arthur Laing bridge. I was driving south and the traffic on Knight Street and Highway 99 was horrendously backed up. The mayor and police have the obligation and power to maintain order, they should have exercised it.
Mayor Gregor has as much in common with the Musqueam First Nations and their cause, as a fat cat has with as mouse. Just saying.
What a hypocrite this Robertson is!
@West End Gal:
The Musqueam are just another stepping stone. And it is truly sad that they haven’t yet recognized it, but in time, they will.
Just like the homeless, and the soon to be under the bridge, ‘affordable housing’ from the 2011 election.
Vision has an agenda, and they do not care who they step on to get there. We are ALL disposable.
Interesting.
Robertson had nothing to say when the Little Mountain Coop was torn down four years ago for NOTHING! 200+ units of affordable housing destroyed. That’s his legacy.
IN bed with the Developers.
Now… LOL, after his administration were the ones that issued the Development permits for the land in question he is now playing the role of the Man of The Musqueam people. The hypocrisy!
Don’t get me wrong, I understand where the issue is, but it’s not with the Developer and it’s not with the band, it’s with the incompetents at City Hall that were supposed to in the least observe due diligenge and do their jobs in a competent manner.
And yes the buck stops with the …”Mayor” LOL!